Marty Crandall has questionable/obvious music taste

the more i listen to that phoenix record, the more i like it. but yeah, the rest is pretty meh.

Is overall top 5 is pretty good.

mine would be better.

Whoa prefix...that's a no-no: Never make fun of another's music tastes -to them. Plus, He put Mew and Hot Chp in there...what's wrong with that? I guess he could have met your hippness standards and chosen: Joanna Newsom, Grizzly Bear, Neko Case, Cat Power, and either Tom Waits or some band no one's heard of... the first 4 especially being grossly overrated. Give the guy a break -the Phoenix album isn't THAT bad...

i tried listening to joanna newsom again last night. and yet again, it was a failed experiment.i certainly wasn't implying the phoenix record was bad. if we had done top 20s instead of 10s, it would have made mine.

I never said that the Phoenix album was THAT bad, but it isn't THAT good either. The same (or worse) goes for the rest of the list as far as I'm concerned. Just one man's opinion, no need for knee-jerk "hipness standards" remarks. Oh, and FYI: you'd totes have to take Neko Case and Cat Power off the list if you're shooting for hipness. Those two are soooooo over.

mew rules!!!

Hey, don't knock the Cat Power, Sheppard!

what are your top 5 Sheppard?

cat power and neko are both so hot.

Chan Marshall is a fine lady, and a talented artist. I just wouldn't call her "hip" anymore.Also, since mystery commenter guy asked:http://idolator.com/?op=jp_showpoll&user_id=42343May the flaming begin!

Moon Pix is my favorite Cat Power album.

Maybe a little boring, but don't knock the guy just because he's not into Clipse. Besides, anyone who likes Hot Chip is okay with me.

I'm not saying JT isn't talented and can't deliver a cool song here and there, but anyone who thinks JT had the #1 overall song of 2006 isn't in any position to criticize someone else's taste.Agree with the Destroyer and B&S picks. That TV on the Radio album is so overrated. It's good but it's no Young Liars. Where was everyone when that dropped back on '03? Too bad Band of Horses or Mew don't have a couple African Americans who can contribute some cool beats...

it's pretty unfair to so blatantly mock someone's taste.

Wht's wrong with JT at #1?What does having black people in a band to "contribute some cool beats" have to do with anything?

Ok swh, please point be towards a catchier more universally appealing song that came out in 2006. Don't worry, i won't hold my breath.I honestly have absolutely no idea how to respond to your pseudo-racist, insinuation-laced final sentence, so I'm just going to choose to ignore it. I do find it humorous though that you naturally assume that I wasn't a fan of "Young Liars" when you don't know me at all.

Also, I'd like to point out that I'm not "blatantly mocking" anyone's taste. I would think it's pretty easy to see the tongue-in-cheek aspect of the post.

to be fair, i'm not sure i pick up on the tongue-in-cheekness here. but i don't think it's that big a deal to say you don't agree with someone's taste...or maybe i'm just used to people not agreeing with mine. although if someone blogged about my bad taste i might not be too thrilled...

I dunno, I figured the "Seth Cohen Starter Pack" thing gave it away. What I mean to say is that it's all in good fun, not a malicious attack, which I thought was obvious.

Way to use the neo-politically correct race card. I really like TV on the Radio but you tell me that image had nothing to do with TV on the Radio's success and overall appeal?? You're a product of contemporay society's ignorant demand that race never be a motivating factor in anything. It just simply is. Believe me, I'm anything but a raicst. And I didn't assume you weren't a fan of Young Liars -I just think there was a lot of pretention with how many people absolutely loved the new record, when they dropped an EP that was far better 3 years before and got little attention.Who cares if JT was universally liked??? What does that have to do with quality? Paris Hilton is univrsally liked as well. How is someone supposed to know if you're being tongue-and-cheek when you're ripping on their music taste?

You're using the race card by saying "Too bad Band of Horses or Mew don'''t have a couple African Americans who can contribute some cool beats''¦" If anything I think they probably would've sold more records if they were a bunch of white guys. That JT song that we put at #1 seemed like the right choice. Not a better beat this year and I'd argue that Timbo was the best producer of 06.I also don't think the writer "ripped" on the Shins taste.

No, the race card to make me look like a racist. That's a false comparison to white guys. (I don't consider that comment racist but it isn't different-in a racist sense- from what I was saying.) Do you think a bunch of white guys could have made such a record? Impossible. That's what makes TV on the Radio so unique and likeable. But just because this is so shouldn't push it to the top. All I'm saying is their image had a lot to do with their appeal. The record is very impressive but not nearly likeable(in a catchy sense) enough to be loved by the masses on it's own. Marketing pushed TV on the Radio to the top.I'd argue Junior Boy's "In the Morning" has a better beat -even so, the best "beat" doesn't equal the best song...or does it? Lyrics?? Dan Bejar anyone?

I wasn't aware that by not taking ehtnicity into account when I judge the merit of a particular song or artist that I was becoming a card-carrying member of ignorant contemporary society. Thanks for clearing that up for me. To address your point, frankly, I WOULD like to think that in 2006/2007 society would be beyond "Oh my god! Black guys in a rock band! Awesome by default!" Maybe that's just a by-product of living in my liberal little corner of the world north of the border. As for the relative merits of Young Liars vs. Return to Cookie Mountain comments, of course the latter received more attention the press. What world are you living in that a debut EP of an unknown band on an indie would receive more hype than a major label LP? Also, please note that I put "catchy" before "universally liked" in regards to JT. I've heard the song roughly 1,000 times now since it's everywhere you go, and I'm still not sick of it. That's the sign of a great pop song.

Dude chill out. Of course you're not going to judge a song or album by the race of the producers. All I'm saying is if you step back and look at it, TV on the Radio's image had a lot to do with their success. It's not a big deal to me- I'ts just how I understand the situation since RTCM isn't nealy catchy enough to be so loved by the masses. I'd like to think the same thing about black guys in a band....but society is definately not beyond that. I hear comments all the time regarding the perceived outstanding exception.And you got the card for the ICS by calling me a racist when what I said isn't a racist remark. Since society has told us to not relate race with anything...if someone does, then is she/he racist?

>>I think Justin said your comment was pseudo-racist. It seemed at the very least a very ignorant thing to say.

I don't want to get wildly involved in this debate, but this was somewhat harsh: "Do you think a bunch of white guys could have made such a record? Impossible."Dave Sitek has a huge hand in this band; isn't he white? And their frontman always got comparisons to Peter Gabriel, of all singers. About the album being overrated compared to Young Liars, even if that was the universal opinion, Return to Cookie Mountain (even if it doesn't live up to the band's old material) is more creative than a lot of the music that came out last year, and when those year end lists came out, the band was competing with other artists, not itself. The band hardly got any exposure in 2003, so in Justin's defense, even if Young Liars was amazing and is liked by fans today, it didn't get much of a chance to get hyped then and a great deal of people likely became fans sometime between then and now.

Also, marketing did have a hand in making TVOTR because they're now on a major, where money is. A lot of white artists on majors get more famous than they would otherwise if they're on majors.

I love your idea of "ignorance." If I say Eminem gets way too much attention because he's a WHITE rapper, is that racist -or ignorant- also?I'm not saying the album isn't good or creative. I guess I just don't understand why EVERYONE loves it when it lacks catchiness. Not that catchiness is pre-req. for great music...but universally liked music always has catchiness to it. I know they have a white guys who's a HUGE factor. It's not like I sat down one night dissecting all this. It's just how it comes across to me -and comments people make contribute to that. So you guys really thing TVOTR's image has nothing to do with their appeal?

Like the two people above me said, you've made comments here that are reinforce racial stereotypes to some degree. I think that qualifies as "pseudo-racist." I didn't call you names, and I don't think you're a racist, because I don't know you and therefore can't form an opinion about you. Some of the things you've said here though, whether you realize it or not, are inflammatory.Also, I think it should be pointed out that the crux of your argument is that because you personally find RTCM to be inferior to Young Liars it follows that this is a universal AND that image must have been the primary motivator is people taking a liking to the album. That's a lot to base off a personal opinion.

You guys are attacking me like I have a personal vendetta out for TVOTR because they're black. That's completely unfair. I'm not bitter -I don't care what albums people think are the best...to each his own. I don't like criticizing others' taste in music...especially to them....or in this (worse) case to the public.My only point is that TVOTR's image contributed heavily to their success last year.

Obviously you're not well-versed in valid logic. I never said them being black is the "primary" reason people like the album -I do think a lot of people were drawn to the record because they were black rockers. And to me that's fine. It IS a good album. The album Young Liars has nothing to do with it -I was just pointing out that personally, I think that album is much better. And i do agree that it couldn't get the attention like the new one because it wasn't on a major label and it was their debut...not to mention it being an EP. That's a fair and reasonable assesment.I really like TVOTR. I think they're awesome. And they definately are unique. But if you think their image had nothing to do with their national -or universal- appeal, then you're just deceiving yourself.What about my Eminem point?

Whether I'd like to admit it or not, this guy is right to a certain degree.

My main beef is with your comment ""Too bad Band of Horses or Mew don'''t have a couple African Americans who can contribute some cool beats''¦"That's just an ignorant thing to say.

I would plead tongue-n-cheekness as well...but i'm interested to know whay that's your main beef? Why is it so ignorant?

Well, the comment about Eminem would be of a slightly different context because when he first came out, he actually was getting noticed for being a white rapper in the mainstream. Claiming he gets attention for race would be a bit of an observation in that case, whereas race is rarely mentioned when TVOTR gets press, so assuming they're big because some of the members are black would actually be an assumption. But someone like Bad Brains, I think, would more fall into the Eminem category.

Do you really think race relative to black people would ever get mentioned in the mainstream? Just liike Sheppard, red flags would be thrown in all over the place. You guys are still assessing it like I'm bitter. I grew up in California and had a lot of black friends. I'm not a racist -who cares if you preface it with pseudo or not...you still used the word racist.

Saying a pseudo-racist comment doesn't make you a racist.Then again having black friends doesn't make you not a racist.I have no idea if you're a racist or not.''"Too bad Band of Horses or Mew don'''t have a couple African Americans who can contribute some cool beats''¦''"I think what your comment was ignorant because it's implying that Band of Horses or Mew would be better off with some black members in the group and in turn taking away from TV on the Radio and what they've accomplished.

"I never said them being black is the ''"primary''" reason people like the album -I do think a lot of people were drawn to the record because they were black rockers"You're splitting hairs here, and I really don't feel like getting into an argument on semantics. "who cares if you preface it with pseudo or not''¦you still used the word racist"The difference is that pseudo-racist is not the same thing as racist. You aren't throwing slurs around, you aren't saying you hate black people, you've simply reinforced a few stereotypes. Your main argument wasn't even what elicited those comments, it was the "Too bad Band of Horses or Mew don'''t have a couple African Americans who can contribute some cool beats" and "Do you think a bunch of white guys could have made such a record? Impossible''" statements that brought this about.

Race relative to blackness is still touchy enough that it wouldn't get mentioned as blatantly as whiteness, but reviewers will touch on race in a glossy way (i.e. noting the band's "gospel influence") so that the focus is still kept on music and not the racial background they're trying to hint at. I'm trying my best not to be accusatory (as there seems to be a lot of finger pointing in ALL directions on this thread), but the offensive aspect of this debate isn't so much your attention to race issues as much as the blunt terms you used to take the thread's focus off bland indie rock and direct it toward race as a reason for a band's popularity.

Sigh...I was a minute too slow not to be redundant.

defense wins games

Park is right about the ignorant statement---if you were taking it seriously. Looking at it, it is pretty ignorant but it was meant to be tongue-n-cheek.I'm not splitting hairs -I said before that society isn't above the "perceived outstanding exception" that is rockers who are black. Thus, the statement. It's not how I personally think about it, as I mentioned many times. What would those "blunt" terms be?You guys still haven't answered whether or not their image had anything to do with theie success?

My comments were more about the state of society and not toward TVOTR themselves. If you thought otherwise, you were just trying to point a finger.

Right on Joydivided. Go SWH!!

The blunt terms are the ones Justin restated: ''"Too bad Band of Horses or Mew don'''t have a couple African Americans who can contribute some cool beats''" and ''"Do you think a bunch of white guys could have made such a record? Impossible.''" Their image may have a bit to do with their success, but I'd like to think they're mostly successful because they're solid musicians that don't sound like anyone else at a time when tons of popular music rips off itself. And that should be the primary reason people like this band. Maybe people like them because they're partially a black band, but that's a personal thing, and regardless of their makeup, they've gotten bigger because they're at a label with enough money to sell their sound.

The second one may be blunt but there's absolutely nothing wrong with it. Like I said, I was commenting more on the perception of TVOTR and not the band themselves.Just cause you guys are uber-sensitive in this no-talking-about-race society doesn't mean I'm wrong. You guys come off ignorant as well in a way.

The blunt terms are the ones Justin restated: ''"Too bad Band of Horses or Mew don'''t have a couple African Americans who can contribute some cool beats''" and ''"Do you think a bunch of white guys could have made such a record? Impossible.''" Their image may have a bit to do with their success, but I'''d like to think they'''re mostly successful because they'''re solid musicians that don'''t sound like anyone else at a time when tons of popular music rips off itself. And that should be the primary reason people like this band. Maybe people like them because they'''re partially a black band, but that'''s a personal thing, and regardless of their makeup, they'''ve gotten bigger because they'''re at a label with enough money to sell their sound.

this is a dumb argument. lets talk about the shins. :)

i hate black people. every last one of them. indie rock is best left to white people. none of that shuckin and jive walkin.

OH NO THIS TIME FIVE MORE BLACK GUYS FROM BROOKLYN STARTED A ROCK BAND! AND THEY HAVE THE NERVE TO BE "CATCHY"...I HEARD THEY SHUCK AND JIVE ON STAGE AS WELL! SANKOFA ------> WWW.MYSPACE.COM/SANKOFAMUSIC GASP...THEY MAY EVEN BE FRIENDS WITH KYP!

ya'll crazy! it's just music. Who cares what the Shins listen too? I could give 2 *****. Cat Power not hip anymore...was she ever? Just kidding. Really people get a life or maybe a better job! I am off to listen to the entire Can/Neu/Faust collection....gottan stay fresh and hip.PS Hot Chip is the **** and don't forget that!

[...] [New York Times Via Brooklyn Vegan] As anyone who glanced at the free-for-all slug out that took place in our comments section last Friday will tell you, the issue of race in rock music can be a touchy subject. It’s a complex issue that touches on a variety of themes including white guilt, racial stereotypes and accusations of novelty. The fact that a number of rock bands with black members have found critical and commercial success recently has begun to change people’s perception vis-a-vis race and music though, which makes the article that the New York Times published yesterday all the more incendiary. I realize it’s the responsibility of the press to report on changes in our culture, but for my money this article accomplishes little more than pointing out how “different” and “outsider” black rock artists and fans are. It also needlessly draws attention to a blatantly segregational term like “blipster.” Read the article and leave your thoughts in the comments below.            [...]

why does it matter? sure he is in a great band and you people expect him to be into the music you approve of, but he is a person with an opinion, and he has the right to have his own preferences. the only thing that should matter to you is the quality of the music his band makes. if you paid attention to that you wouldn't even be questioning his personal taste.
(and how did this turn into a race issue? this also is something that shouldn't matter when choosing which bands you like. listen with your ears, not your eyes.)

So - you guys are talking about Justin Timberlake right?
p.s. remind me to spend more time capping on people's music tastes.